[Capri25] RE: Fleet Captains Meeting

Sat Mar 10 08:12:53 CST 2007

I thought what Dan said was spot-on. I hope I am not opening a can of worms,
but here are ideas to put on the table for discussion:

1.	Look to place term limits on yacht club positions in an effort to
reduce entrenchment of ideas and balance of power. The off-set might be that
no one would fill the positions. Counter to the counter - many folks are
intimidated about becoming involved because the jobs appear inside a closed
system.  
2.	Larger fleets need more representation. Practically speaking, the
Sonar fleet gets twice the number of votes that the Capri fleet does with 16
boats verses 31, respectively. 
3.	Hasty decisions regarding course and start changes could have
lasting effects on fleet moral.  They should be well thought out. Any course
and starting sequence changes should be rotational. If they are fair, that
should not be a problem. 
4.	In my view, trap. courses debase the race. Would increasing the
start intervals be a positive alternative to start with-- no pun intended? 
5.	Justice delayed is justice denied. That is the other side of hasty
decisions. My boat has spent a lot of time waiting to have protest heard
with no regard to its effects and the unintended consequences. Many times we
just skip it. If you are the defendant in a protest - drag your feet, have a
beer and be frequently indisposed - you will probably win by default. When
Dick Rose and Dave Perry came to speak about the rules a year or so ago,
they were very straight-forward. The heavy burden of over-complicated and
delayed protest hearings has made the rules at the WYC a shaggy dog story. 
6.	I did not appreciate the notification letter bemoaning cost
increases and spelling out per-foot slip charges and mooring fee increases.
The total number of moorings and slips at the club are fixed and their
market value is not a function of boat length. That increase should be
revisited.
7.	Some thought should be given to the situation where boats are sailed
singe-handed and so, posing a risk to other watercraft and putting fleet
competitors at a conspicuous weight disadvantage. Why are we
weight-adjusting our boats relative to cushions when a boat can sail
single-handed in a 20 knot blow flying the shoot in the bay - that seems
silly. 
8.	I would look at the crane with more of a win-win pricing structure.
As it stands now, the people who rarely use the crane are subsidizing those
who utilize the crane all the time. Therefore, I would lower the single use
amount and raise the flat seasonal rate, i.e. $50 per use or $150 per year,
your choice.  Also, would the Wayzata city fathers object to a lighted
Christmas tree atop the crane in the winter? 

These are my thoughts. Cordially submitted, Douglas Nedemier, Sergeant at
Arms.

-----Original Message-----
From: capri25-bounces at lists.wyc.org [mailto:capri25-bounces at lists.wyc.org]
On Behalf Of Kai Kroll
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 5:15 PM
To: 'Kai Kroll'; capri25 at lists.wyc.org
Subject: [Capri25] RE: Fleet Captains Meeting

Capri-25ers:

Thanks for all of the feedback.  Unfortunately, due to limited time and
lacking an iterative discussion, there is nothing approaching a consensus.  

If I were forced to present a fleet position, it would be:  The change in
start sequence is OK, if we always race the trap, but the fleet wants
windward leeward courses - not the trap.  ????

I hope we get a chance to discuss this at the Capri-25 winter meeting prior
to the race committee making a decision.  In the future it would be nice if
the fleet captain's meeting agenda and proposals were distributed a few
months in advance to allow the fleets to meet and discuss the options.

Have a good weekend, see you all soon.

Kai

  _____  

From: Kai Kroll [mailto:kroll at oncostim.com] 
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 10:51 AM
To: 'capri25 at lists.wyc.org'
Subject: Fleet Captains Meeting 

Capri-25ers:

The fleet captain meeting is this Friday night.  The agenda and proposed new
starting sequence are in the emails below:

I would appreciate feedback on the proposed starting sequence and other
agenda items so that I am able to properly represent the fleet at the
meeting.

Thanks,

Kai

  _____  

From: fleets-bounces at lists.wyc.org [mailto:fleets-bounces at lists.wyc.org] On
Behalf Of Bert Foster
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2007 5:19 PM
To: WYC Fleet Captains; Mary Beth Hovey; Fred Somme; Jarod Silverman; Blake
Middleton
Subject: [Fleets] Fleet Captains Meeting Friday Starting Order Discussion @
Bert's House 7:00pm

Hi All,
We are trying to make it lest congested by using the Trapezoid courses and
maybe changing the order of the start and the courses, left or right, fleets
sail.

The plan below came up last night in a discussion I had with assistant RC
Chairman, Terry Foster.  See what you think.

Starting Order           Left Course     Right Course
1)      S2 7.9                             X
2)      J-24                                X
3)      J-22                                X
4)      Sonar                              X
5)      Capri-25                                             X
6)      PHRF I & Ensign                              X
7)      MORC II & III                                 X
8)      PHRF I, II, III                                   X

The plan here is: 

*          to start the fleets generally in the order of upwind speed so a
later starting fleet doesn't catch an earlier starting fleet at the 1st
windward mark, as has been happening in some cases now. 

*         sail most of the one-design fleets that are rigged pretty much the
same (fractional rig, big jibs in front and small jibs in back) on the left
hand course. They will not have a tendency to catch each other and the
fastest S2 7.9 may not lap into the Sonars as they have to make up 2 full
legs and have a 9 minute head start. 

*         these fleets are generally less strung out than the others.
Therefore, if we start them with the fastest boats first, they won't be
running over one another. 

*         moving the Ensign after the Capri-25 means the Capri-25s won't
have the problem running over them on the first beat, particularly at the WW
mark, as was a problem for the J-22s.  Note the Ensigns do not come out for
Sunday, only Thursday.  Moving the Ensigns to star with PHRF I  means 2
small fleets and the PHRF Is can mostly sail away from the Ensigns right off
the start (as the Sonars have been doing) and the Ensign won't be run over
by the smaller MORC boats as they were by the J-22s. 

*         By having the Capri-25s start in this new slot they won't be run
over by the S2 7.9s and they probably won't be running over many Sonars on
the first beat. 

*         By having the Capri-25s start first of the right course boats,
they will have clear sailing for at least their first 2 legs, maybe more.
By the time they start to mix it up with the other right course boats, they
will be well strung out.  As they do mix it up with the handicap boats they
should be able to quickly sail through them.  Some of the handicaps boats
will also be on a triangle course out of their way. 

Regards,
Bert

Hi All,
Enough of you responded that Friday is the best time.  If you can't make it,
send someone who is experienced in your fleet as your representative.  One
one person per fleet plus the RC of Bert, Blake, Jared, and Fred.

I will provide beverages.  MB, maybe bring a bottle of wine you like.  I
have some but you may not like it, as I don't know wine.

Meeting Agenda 

*         Fleet Captains Duties 

*         Possible Starting Order Change 

*         Each Fleets Desired Courses and length.  Come prepared. 

*         Protests, out of fleet courtesy, and "CROSS OR TACK" 

*         Anything else anybody wants to bring up 

Regards,
Bert 

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